Plaza Forum

General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: AmyAmy on December 23, 2015, 02:02:59 PM

Title: Story Codes and Consent
Post by: AmyAmy on December 23, 2015, 02:02:59 PM
Yes, I've read the section on story codes. These codes have been around as long as I can remember.

One thing has puzzled me for some time.

Can anyone explain to me why stories full of non-consensual activity - characters in strict bondage being harshy dominated, with no hope of resistance, quite frequently have the code "cons/nc"?

Shouldn't these stories be simply "nc"? Doesn't "cons/nc" mean that the victim substantially consents to some fair proportion of what is happening?

Rather often I find myself reading a story that I feel is entirely "nc" and it's marked "cons/nc". What am I not understanding?

For example, how is a character, kidnapped entirely against her will and placed in overwhelming bondage consenting? Is it because she doesn't struggle to the death?

Or does the "cons" part refer to the men brutally raping the defenceless protagonist, who are fully consenting in their activity?

Maybe I'm going overboard a bit, but the vague euphemism of "nc" doesn't remotely cut it for stories that pass into "violently invasive" or "brutally violating". Maybe they need their own special story codes to convey the threatening nature, the intensity and inability to resist the abuse/out-and-out-torture?

Maybe there also ought to be a code for "sickeningly horrifying"? Yes, in the aforementioned story the abuses threatened aren't actually shown being enacted, but the impact is there nonethless.

Don't mistake me, I'm not saying such stories should be censored, but less ambiguous labelling would be a plus, I think. Maybe the "XXX" would convey it, but not when there is a "cons" tag suggesting some level of consent.

If you are forced to do something, or put under threat of death, or pain, or blackmail, that's not consent. It's not even reluctant. It's totally "nc", at the very least.

Maybe there's a convention at play here that I'm missing, but if so, it's not a helpful convention.
Title: Re: Story Codes and Consent
Post by: Gromet on December 23, 2015, 02:30:09 PM
Well if you look at the other side of the coin someone is 'cons' trying/capturing/using the 'nc' or 'reluct'.

I tend not to post stories that contain rape or scenes of extreme violence - some stories do come with either 'caution' or 'warning' in the codes or have a message before the story warning of the content contained.

The codes themselves were modified from the Alt.Sex.Stories -
Why re-invent the wheel!

I'm open to new storycodes, if the author wants to add specific codes to their story that's fine - they know the story better than I do.

I'm open to suggestions regarding storycodes.

Title: Re: Story Codes and Consent
Post by: Daffy Duck on December 23, 2015, 03:07:59 PM
My transformation stories often contain a new story code: m2object !

Title: Re: Story Codes and Consent
Post by: TeaSer on December 23, 2015, 03:09:58 PM
In general I find the storycodes well used - but I must admit to AmyAmy that stories exists where the cons is very difficult to locate.

For me (personal view!) a cons/nc-story might start out with an abduction and even a rape. It's important though that the victim at least at some point reveals some kind of consensuality. She might be violated, but she should feel content about it.

As Gromet says: This really is an obligation for the writers. And (referring to a thread on the 'old' forum) setting the readers expectations is an important way of gaining satisfied readers. If the storycodes doesn't fully cover the content, the writer should add more description to this section of the story. I'm sure Gromet will be happy to include such a thing if present in a story.

Title: Re: Story Codes and Consent
Post by: AmyAmy on December 24, 2015, 07:59:18 AM
Yes, I'm aware these codes have been around since the days of steam trains and clockwork phones.

It's the use I can't quite get my head around.

Well if you look at the other side of the coin someone is 'cons' trying/capturing/using the 'nc' or 'reluct'.

Are you saying (as I hazarded before) that the antagonist is 'cons' and the protagonist is 'nc'?
In the same way the codes write M/f, etc?

I was seeing things like reluct/nc and thinking it meant the protagonist was both reluct and nc, depending on the scene, not that the first one was the antagonist. It never occurred to me until last night.

If it was always cons/cons, or cons/nc, or nc/cons, or reluct/cons I might have guessed it, but there are stories that aren't self-bondage that simply have codes like 'nc' (see Anne Gray for example), but when you read the story it's fairly plain it's nc/cons (cons protagonist).

I guess that was the main thing I couldn't get about the consent coding.

Wanting stories that contain stuff that gives me nightmares for a week to have clearer codes is a different issue, though it would be nice. TBH the author is usually a give away, but not everyone knows all the authors.

When I see 'torment' and 'XX' I don't immediately think "this story is going to be extremely disturbing and contain references to horrific and extreme torture".

'Torment' is defined in the storycodes section as 'causing mild pain ie: spanking, nipple clamps'.
Maybe just me, but there are a few stories I'd have given a 'torture' rating to, rather than the mild sounding 'torment'.

I'd hate to think of someone reading Betrayal chapter 1 and thinking it's going to be mild, or somebody reading Turned into Nothing and thinking there will be a bit of mild torment. Yes, anyone who's seen an M88 story might think there's a pretty slim chance of that given the title, but it might be the first one they read. And then they come away thinking "this is what they call mild, I'd better not read an extreme one."

Of course it's hard to get right, especially when you have events that are merely discussed but not shown, and which might never happen. I think if the story conveys those non-occurring events powerfully, they might as well be happening.

Let's say we have a story where a menacing villain scares the heroine with detailed descriptions and threats of rape, isn't that as disturbing as portraying the actual events? Sure, it never happens, but the impact on the reader is the same. Fiction at one level or remove isn't much stronger than fiction at two levels of remove.
Title: Re: Story Codes and Consent
Post by: Gromet on December 24, 2015, 08:11:21 AM
Thanks Amy, I like debate about stuff and situations regarding the plaza, it's one way I learn what people who visit the site think and what they expect. Like feedback for stories feedback about the site is very rare.

It can be very hard when reading a story to remember all of the codes applicable, especially for a long story - then try reading 10 in one hit - I try as best as I can to code the stories and I will warn people if the content is not suitable, but stories that contain stuff too nasty usually don't get posted here, though I do give some leeway to authors who already have many stories on the plaza.

The storycodes have changed over time so some of the earlier stories codes would be different if applied today, the codes are there as shorthand for the reader to select if thy wish to read that story, this is an adult stories website after all and we all have different tastes, so what is cons for some maybe reluct or nc for others.

If you see a story that you don't agree with the storycodes - please let me know and suggest what they should be. If there is a story without codes then read it and let me know what they should be.